'Obamacare' LIVES!

[derricksonb]

Any doctor can refuse a patient--private/federal/state doctor. Fed/state doctor can say they do not perform whatever the patient needs. And its all done behind closed doors. Yes, that Fed/state doctor will have to defend their decision but they can turn away anyone.

ER's (emergency rooms) can also turn away. The reason the wait is the emergency relies on small staff and have to call in specialist if something unusual. I know, I sliced my hand while working the night shift and after waiting for a couple hours at Fairfax, they came very close to bandaging me up and sending me home to return the next day ugh!! But I was very lucky in that a plastic surgeon just completed a surgery and said he would look at my hand--he fixed it. But, at the reception they wanted to how I was going to handle payment. They wanted insurance card or AmExpress--thank God, I had both. That was BEFORE they let me past the entrance to see a nurse.

So then I'm assuming that by your account of one personal experience at one Emergency Room that I can safely assume that ALL Illegal immigrants and bottom feeder Americans must have some form of secret underground insurance and an American Express Card in order to receive treatment at the ER?!?!?!?!? The bottom line is that we DO have a system in place in America that works where by Obama's own words his plan will cost the same for actual medical coverage of these persons. The question being if it's supposed to cost us the same then why has the cost estimate gone from $890B to $2.7T (est) over the next 10 years? The answer to that is simple.... to increase the profits of publicly traded insurance companies.

[cindylu]

So then I'm assuming that by your account of one personal experience at one Emergency Room that I can safely assume that ALL Illegal immigrants and bottom feeder Americans must have some form of secret underground insurance and an American Express Card in order to receive treatment at the ER?!?!?!?!? The bottom line is that we DO have a system in place in America that works where by Obama's own words his plan will cost the same for actual medical coverage of these persons. The question being if it's supposed to cost us the same then why has the cost estimate gone from $890B to $2.7T (est) over the next 10 years? The answer to that is simple.... to increase the profits of publicly traded insurance companies.

What are you talking about??

[derricksonb]

What are you talking about??

I've taken your one account and asked you a simple question.If by your one account then can I assume that your argument is moot?

[BigTom]

Somebody recently mentioned one - the Veterans Administration. Try polling vets and see if they want to privatize it! Fact is, they love it. A second example is related - the military. Do you really think a private company could protect the country as well as the government?

Social Security has it's problems, but mismanagement isn't one of them. But anyway how would privatizing it suddenly result in better management?

The Post Office hasn't actually been run by the government since 1970. They too have lots of problems - mostly dealing with the loss of revenue bought about by the rise of the internet, but mismanagement doesn't seem to be a large factor. Unlikely you could actually get a private company to agree to deliver all letters to all places - and not just the more profitable parcels to the population centers.

The V.A., the Post Office, and Social Security are being run efficiently? WHAT? I don't even know how to discuss this with you. You're so far out in left field I don't know where to begin. Just to make sure we're on the same page you are talking about the U.S. on planet Earth in the year 2012?

[derricksonb]

The V.A., the Post Office, and Social Security are being run efficiently? WHAT? I don't even know how to discuss this with you. You're so far out in left field I don't know where to begin. Just to make sure we're on the same page you are talking about the U.S. on planet Earth in the year 2012?

I believe this pretty much sums up this discussion.....

confuse_a_liberal_use_logic_and_facts_bumper_sticker-p128599358492103443en7pq_210.jpg

[Tony]

The V.A., the Post Office, and Social Security are being run efficiently? WHAT? I don't even know how to discuss this with you.

Like DB just said, you need some facts on your side. The place to begin the discussion would be to find some sort of metric defining "business management efficiency", then comparing apples to apples. But I doubt such a beast exists.

Remember, nobody is claiming these - or any other random business - is running at 100% efficiency. Certainly it's a daily endeavor for any business to improve efficiency. I just think that compared to any other similar private business they rank right up there. Prove me wrong with facts if you can, otherwise get off the pot.

PS If you do manage to prove they're less efficient than a comparable private business, then you have to explain why the Republicans never 'fixed' them when they had the chance.

[cindylu]

The Post Office is not run by the govt. Unfortunately, they are saddled by old retirement plan they have to pay out to past retirees.

Here is link on "privatization" of post office. http://www.downsizinggovernment.org/usps

[derricksonb]

Like DB just said, you need some facts on your side.

I was actually referring to you with that graphic, but that's another testiment to how truly clueless you are..... Good Job

The place to begin the discussion would be to find some sort of metric defining "business management efficiency", then comparing apples to apples. But I doubt such a beast exists.

Remember, nobody is claiming these - or any other random business - is running at 100% efficiency. Certainly it's a daily endeavor for any business to improve efficiency. I just think that compared to any other similar private business they rank right up there. Prove me wrong with facts if you can, otherwise get off the pot.

OK I'll play, but the only facts I can provide are the metrics I collected from my years of experience working in both the private and government sectors.

In the world of telecommunications private industry can have a T1 operational in less than 2 days from the time it is ordered, provisioned, engineered, last mile installed and field service dispatched for test and turn up at a cost between $212 to $1200 per month.

In the world of government telecommunications it takes Defense Information Systems Agency (DISA) more than 18 months from the time circuit is ordered, provisioned, engineered, contract sent to DITCO for TELCo compete, equipment ordered, Information Assurance (IA) paperwork submitted to DSS, crypto and key issued from NSA, last mile installed to the demarc, Visitor Access Requests (VAR) approved by both node and customer sides and field service dispatched to both locations for test, turn up and acceptance. All of this for the amazing low price of $41,000.00 for installation and estimated monthly charges of $2,800.00 to $7,000.00 per month depending on the distance to the customer node from the DISA node.

PS If you do manage to prove they're less efficient than a comparable private business, then you have to explain why the Republicans never 'fixed' them when they had the chance.

This would probably have something to do with the fact that the Contracting Offices (KOs) are stiflled by the Unions (Democrat controlled if you want to do down that road) who keep a tight leash on the contracting timeframes and how hard their tea cup government employees are pushed. There is also no incentive for the workers in the KOs office to slip their schedules to the left.

[Mountain_Nomad]

I just think that compared to any other similar private business they rank right up there. Prove me wrong with facts if you can, otherwise get off the pot.

Hard to do an Apples to Apples comparison of a government entity and business (for profit) but the US Post office is one that can be compared to private companies in the same line of business.

- US Post Office;(574,000 employees) “losing money at a rate of about $3 billion per quarter in 2011”
http://www.nacsonline.com/NACS/Magaz.../Feature3.aspx

- Federal Express (101,000 employees); 2011 profit 10,823,000
http://investing.money.msn.com/inves...nt/?symbol=FDX

- UPS (398,000 employees); 2011 Profit $12,996,000.
http://investing.money.msn.com/inves...nt/?symbol=UPS

One can argue that they have the Burden of delivering all letters but it also seems that that they are slow to change to the reality of the needs of a changing population. I.E., e-mail has replaced most personal mail, and why hasn't USPS been converting more communities to a "Community Mail box"? They still deliver door-to-door or box to box so seem destined to just react to the slowly dwindling revenue instead of being proactive.

Outside of the Post Office, waste/inefficiencies abound in other government entities. That seems to happen when there is no profit incentive to minimize it. Or should we believe the GSA Official (Neely) was an aberration and other government agencies are immune to similar things?

PS If you do manage to prove they're less efficient than a comparable private business, then you have to explain why the Republicans never 'fixed' them when they had the chance.

The US Government is a system of checks and balances. It ensures that one entity does not have absolute power to make changes the way they see fit.

I believe Republicans would have fixed things the way they saw fit if they were somehow able to gain control of all branches of government. I.E., similar to what Hugo Chavez is doing in Venezuela. Finger pointing only works on those who aren’t paying attention.



http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...21nU_blog.html

[cindylu]

Post office is not allowed to make a profit.

[Tony]

I believe Republicans would have fixed things the way they saw fit if they were somehow able to gain control of all branches of government.

You may be too young to remember 'ancient history', but this last occurred only a few years ago in 2006. They managed to saddle us with TSA and the Patriot Act, and we all loved the huge Bush tax cuts to go along with the ridiculous expensive wars they jumped into. But there was no effort to improve health care or improve efficiency at the VA. The only noises they made about 'improving' social security was to completely privatize it! Yikes!

Anyway, I doubt total control would be necessary. If they could demonstrate inefficiency at the VA and introduced good legislation to fix it, I'm sure lots of Democrats would join in.

And again, the USPS is not actually "the government" since 1970. And there is no other letter delivery company that must service the entire US regardless of profit, so comparisons fail.

[Mountain_Nomad]

Post office is not allowed to make a profit.

OK. Are you saying USPS is efficient but can't be judged by financial results?

Operating at an annual loss of 12 billion just doesn't sound too efficient to me.

[Mountain_Nomad]

You may be too young to remember 'ancient history', but this last occurred only a few years ago in 2006. They managed to saddle us with TSA and the Patriot Act, and we all loved the huge Bush tax cuts to go along with the ridiculous expensive wars they jumped into..

With that same logic, Democrats could've reversed the horrific actions of 2006 when they controlled both houses.

And, I’m not too young to remember some history. I do remember some about how the TSA was formed, Both parties were involved. I.E.,

Democrats successfully pushed to federalize airport screening in 2001, always with the goal in mind of augmenting the union rolls with thousands of dues-paying members. These powerful organizations just happen to be key players in getting out the vote for Democrats. AFGE and NTEU gave a combined $1.4 million in donations last cycle, 98.3 percent of which landed in the campaign coffers of congressional Democrats.

The unionization order followed Mr. Pistole’s Jan. 28 decision to block airports from taking further advantage of a program that allowed airports to opt to use private screening contractors for security matters. Already, 16 airports, including those in San Francisco and Kansas City, decided their customers deserved better treatment. Obama administration officials saw the opt-out program as a direct threat to their union-boosting plans.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...s-compromised/

we all loved the huge Bush tax cuts to go along with the ridiculous expensive wars they jumped into.

I didn’t agree with the way these wars were handled under Bush and still don’t under Obama where costs more than doubled in Afghanistan. We got Bin Laden and there's an endless supply of Terrorists. Why are we still there?




If you loved that you loved the cost of wars, you'll be ecstatic with the increased cost of Health Insurance Reform will be bringing in the coming years…...

And again, the USPS is not actually "the government" since 1970. And there is no other letter delivery company that must service the entire US regardless of profit, so comparisons fail.

Yes, six of one, half a dozen the other. The USPS is still a government agency. It just operates independently of the Federal Government.

With the advent of the Internet creating an alternate way to pay bills and communicate, the need for home mail delivery 6 days a week has long passed.

With the cost of fuel, cutting back to 3 or 4 days for home deliveries would save a bundle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_...Postal_Service

[cindylu]

OK. Are you saying USPS is efficient but can't be judged by financial results?

Operating at an annual loss of 12 billion just doesn't sound too efficient to me.

You are absolutely correct--they are not efficient. Read the report I posted as a link --it was supplied by the CATO Institute. Says why they are not allowed to make a profit and yet they have to compete with private industry which is totally stupid.

[Chutney Daftcraft]

Fedex/UPS delivers way less parcels and charges way more per parcel than the USPS. Comparing the two is a joke without the haha.

[cindylu]

Fedex/UPS delivers way less parcels and charges way more per parcel than the USPS. Comparing the two is a joke without the haha.

FedEx/UPS also have their fleet of planes to provide real AIR-mail.

[bret]

http://www.cnbc.com/id/45049636/Fixi...ice_s_Finances here,s a atempt to privatetize the po for vulture capitalist